China: Wikipedia's Jimmy Wales meets China's censors

Rebecca Mackinnon from Rconversation blogs about Jimmy Wales recent meeting with Cai Mingzhao, Vice Director of China's State Council Information Office – the government body whose “Internet Management Division” is in charge of censoring online content.


  • Statue of Liberty

    ==Snip==Wales: We didn’t discuss it. But, I am not cool with any censorship of Wikipedia. However, I do think it is much better for a few politically sensitive pages to be blocked than for everything to be blocked. And we will never cooperate with any blocking or censorship of neutral encyclopedic content==Snip==

    Mr.Wales, how are you going to define “a few politically sensitive pages” ? What is ‘a few’? A few 10s? 100? 1000? With WIKI web pages in the millions(or ten of millions), who is going to do the actual counting of “a few”?
    Mr.Wales, you should tell them in their face, it is “all” or “nothing”.
    Unless they have already bought your company, then that is a different story.

  • What’s most important is that there’s a dialogue open: Wikipedia tries to post neutral, verifiable information and if the Chinese government wants to censor that in political areas, that is a problem. While on the one hand yes, an “all or nothing” plan is a strong suit against censorship, perhaps this is a more subtle plan to wedge in the neutral content by association over time. If Wikipedia can be partly-unblocked in China, that may be a step closer to getting it fully unblocked.
    Despite that it may not be ideal, working with the conflict and moving forward is, quite possibly, a much better plan than the historical stalemate. Time will tell.

  • Statue of Liberty

    Internet was designed to withstand the onslaught of a nuclear attack, but the original designers had forgotten one vital thing: Human Greed.
    Google had “kowtow” to the red emperor(who has no clothes), is Wikipedia going to do likewise?
    Yes, time will tell, but after all the under-the-table deal is done, there will be no one left to yell:”He has got no clothes!”

  • Statue of Liberty

    The State Council Central Government Offices Special Food Supply Center is specifically designed to avoid the problems troubling the general population.

    “We all know that average production facilities use large quantities of chemical fertilizers and pesticides. Antibiotics and hormones are commonly used in raising livestock and poultry. Farmed aquatic products are contaminated by various kinds of water pollution,” the center’s director, Zhu Yonglan, said in a speech.–snip–

    Well, the communist elite know what to do. They have already move their wealth, families, children, etc to USA, UK, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, where the food, the air, the water, everything is squeaky clean, and no internet fire wall.
    While they themselves stay behind to boss over China, and enjoy the food and drinks from the “Special Supply Center”, naturally they would use the Great Fire Wall to stop their own citizens from knowing anything about the outside world.
    Naturally they would use $$$ to buy Mr.Wales’s company.
    See how much they bought into Fanny May and Fredy Mac?
    Wikipedia is just a small fly, no problem, Chinese may be short of morality, but have plenty of US $$$

  • Statue of Liberty

    《四庫全書》是中國歷史上規模最大的一套叢書(其次是明朝的《永樂大典》)。[1]清乾隆三十八年(1773年)開始編纂,歷時9年成書。共收書 3503種,79337卷,36304冊,近230萬頁,約8億字。[2][3]整套書收録了從先秦到清乾隆前大部的重要古籍(一部分被列為禁書),涵蓋了古代中國幾乎所有學術領域。

    Above is the main page of Wikipedia’s article on 《四庫全書》, the Chinese encyclopedia edited during the Manchu ruler Qianlong 乾隆.

    (A):《四库全书》的编修可以说是全国图书都要进献检查,不仅不利于满清的文献被禁毁,连前人涉及契丹(Khitan)、女真(Nuzhen, Juchen)、蒙古(Mongol)、辽(Liao)金(Jin)元(Yuan)的文字都要进行篡改。查缴禁书竟达三千多种,十五万多部,总共焚毁的图书超过七十万部,禁毁书籍与四库所收书籍一样多。



    Above is 百度百科(a Baidu’s version of Wikipedia) main page on 《四库全书》, which paints a different story.
    On (A), Baidu says: Manchu court was checking all the books within the country, they not only ban and destroy books that contain unfavorable opinions towards Manchu, they even change the words of any books on Khitan, Juchen, Mongol, Liao, Jin, Yuan. They ban more then 3000 groups of books, 150,000 books, all together burned 700,000 plus books, the number of books they burned was equivalent to the number of books collected under 《四库全书》.
    On (B), Baidu says: Everybody(Chinese) knows that all those ancient books collected under 《四库全书》 had been edited and modified, Ming Dynasty’s books on literature and history were being destroyed on massive scale, even books from North Song Dynasty and South Song Dynasty were destroyed.
    On (C), contemporary scholars have discovered, all the historical texts describing the massacre of other ethnic by Mongol and Jin were being deleted and modified in 《四库全书》. The Manchu also conduct blatant smearing campaign on Han (漢) ethnic. For example, Manchu told us that on a stone monument erected by 张献忠(one of the Ming Dynasty’s general) there were 7 Kill, Kill, Kill, Kill, Kill, Kill, Kill, words. But according to the recent scholar’s discovery, there is no such things like seven KILL words. The Manchu runing dogs were telling lies about Han (漢) ethnic race.

    Rebecca, you sit on the Wikimedia’s Advisory Board, when you have time, can you please raise this issue towards other 19 members of the Advisory Board, including chairperson Angela Beesley, including Mr. Jimmy Wales, and tell them that Wikipedia Chinese version(zh Wikipedia) has a serious inner structural flaw. Tell them that zh.Wikipedia is very sick, because majority of the editors of zh.Wikipedia not only sick, they are cultural eunuchs. They have castrated their own conscience, throw away all the morality, and act and live a life of 奴才, minion, flunkey. And they will be recorded in future history books as such.

  • Carl

    Status of Liberty:

    Your “all or nothing” attitude wouldn’t work for China. According to your logic, China can only be a 100% communist country or not a communist country at all? If that’s true, where do changes come from?

    I see this meeting as a positive step by Jimmy and Chinese government officials.

  • Jim Welder

    Do you mean the same Wikipedia whose head honcho Jim Wales was caught stealing finds donated by contributors ?

  • Wikipedian

    “Imagine a world in which every single person is given free access to the sum of all human knowledge.”

    Quote:”That is the ambitious mission statement of the Wikimedia Foundation. Don’t be at all surprised if this statement of intent becomes a reality….one day! The o­nline presence of these projects is fast becoming the ‘first stops’ for many students and teachers around the globe who seek accurate information, latest news and free media and resources. In fact, many schools and other educational establishments are actually contributing towards its development.Unquoted.

  • Ding Junhui

    zh wikipedia is absolutely shit



    Translation: roughly: The claimed 800,000 Chinese Han being mass murdered by Manchu soldiers during the ten days of Yangzhou is to be doubted. It was suggested that the book 《揚州十日記》has too many errors and self-contradicting errors……..The numbers killed may be as low as 100,000.

    Statue of Liberty comments: It was suggested that whoever wrote this piece of shit and put it on zh.wikipedia must be a moron, the end result of a sexual intercourse between a Manchu soldier and a female dog.

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