“Beware of Egyptian Men,” says the Canadian Embassy

Back in December 2007, I was almost crucified for writing a post entitled: Relationshsips Warning: Do not date Egyptian Men. In that article, I said:

Because of the nature of my work in the tourism sector, I am used to hearing that this or that country has issued a travel warning to its citizens who plan on traveling to Egypt, especially in the aftermath of an attack. Naturally, most warnings address safety and security issues, and some warnings dedicate a section or two to hygiene and harassment. Lately, and because of the increasing number of divorces, custody issues, and domestic violence cases, some countries warn their women from Egyptian men. Yes, they tell them clearly not to get emotionally involved or legally committed to an Egyptian man!

Wandering Scarab - an Egyptian girl living in Canada – prior to her last visit to Egypt, decided to visit the Canadian Consulate website to register with the consulate in Egypt just in case her Canadian husband or her baby girl needed assistance with travel or local authorities. What she read on the site was appalling and ended up in her writing this post.

On the page specific to Egypt the first item displayed recent updates about major events in the country, like strikes and riots or disease outbreak, of which there was none for Egypt. So far so good. The second item displayed warning and recommendations where “EXERCISE HIGH DEGREE OF CAUTION” was in bold and highlighted in blue. I went on to read why the good people in the Foreign Affairs department think that I should exercise a high degree of caution. Among the many warnings, ranging from terrorist attacks and unexploded landmines to substandard medical care, there was this excerpt:

Women, particularly foreign women, are frequently subject to unpleasant male attention, sexual harassment, and verbal abuse. This often takes the form of staring, inappropriate remarks, catcalls, and touching. The Department publishes a booklet entitled Her Own Way: A Woman’s Guide to Safe and Successful Travel. Its prime objective is to inform Canadian women and encourage them to travel safely.

There are reports of female Canadian citizens being forced into marriage without their prior knowledge or consent. Parents, relatives and the community may use relentless pressure and emotional blackmail, threatening behavior, abduction, imprisonment and physical violence to coerce young people to enter into marriage. While both men and women experience forced marriages, it is a form of violence most commonly perpetrated against women. They have been unable to return to Canada, and their passports and money have been retained by family members. Canada opposes the practice of forced marriage and urges all countries to respect their international human rights obligations relating to free and full consent to marriage. Forced marriage constitutes a human rights violation under several legal instruments, including international human rights law, to which Canada is a signatory.

The Wandering Scarab thinks that the fact that the Canadian government went though the trouble of creating and promoting such a booklet suggests:

a. they are not exaggerating about the warning, and

b. the incidents of harassment happen frequently enough that there had to be a public warning about them.

This is the first thing Canadian women learn about Egypt. How embarrassing and sad this is.

Trying to overcome her shock and sense of indignation, she was struck by a second clause:

Canadian citizens who were born in Egypt, or who were born outside Egypt to an Egyptian father, are considered citizens of Egypt. Consular assistance, if required, will be granted by the Egyptian authorities on a case-by-case basis.

In other words, because I have dual citizenship, Egypt has the right to refuse the assistance of the Canadian Consulate in the event that I need such assistance. Let me reflect on that for a minute… OK, so even though I'm a Canadian citizen, Egyptian authorities will treat me as an Egyptian citizen, which means that if something happens, I can be denied legal counsel, held without charge indefinitely, interrogated (tortured) in prison, and prosecuted in Egyptian courts.

How was this particular dilemma resolved?

After not much thought I did indeed register. However, I registered using my husband's name, since he does not have the Egyptian citizenship. I avoided putting my name on the forms like it was the plague.

In pursuit of my original cause; Egyptian men taking advantage of foreign women, I found Insteadi who is “a trailing Scottish bird in Cairo” who dedicated a post for the nature of the relationship between Egyptian men and foreign women.

I just read an interesting article from Egypt's Daily Star (nothing like the UK one!). It is about men looking for foreign (note they actually use the word ‘blonde’) wives to finance them. I have seen this sort of thing time and time again here, with the foreign woman usually being a tourist when she ‘falls in love’ and not understanding that her beau could actually have ulterior motives. Why should she? He says such beautiful things to her, makes her feel so special, so wanted. He is so romantic (it's a shame she doesn't understand Arabic or she'd realize when song lyrics are being translated). Later comes the demonstrations that ‘he's not like that’. Frequently divorce is on the horizon. Soon after that, I don't know what happens with her, but he remarries: IT'S BUSINESS.

While I understand life in Egypt is tougher by the day, it surely can't be fair to enter a marriage you believe is for love, when the reality is that an entire family is plotting how to cajole you out of your money.

Words, beautiful or not, are cheap.

90 comments

  • Ms.Canadian

    I think finding a warning on abuse of women laughable is pretty awful. I guess it’s not been your experience in Egypt. We’re not saying ALL Egyptian men are this way, we are just saying these things are possible and beware of them. Just like the occasional bombing. The warning is only advocating exercising intelligent judgment in other words. As a woman, I am quite surprised that you wouldn’t agree. But I guess as a Canadian business woman, you wouldn’t want to deter tourists from coming to Egypt, would you?

  • Crystal,

    Actually my comment wasn’t aimed at you at all and I don’t find the warning laughable. I found the embassy warning very poorly written and not to the real point at all. I deal with people at the embassy all the time and some of them can’t write their way out of a closet. That’s the nameless bureaucrat I was addressing.

    I warn women all the time about finding “the love of their lives” here while on holiday, but I think that the warning should be much more to the point of “think before you do something stupid because all you see are roses and birdies”. If that sounds a bit brutal that is because I’ve helped various women leave husbands to stay here or to leave husbands and Egypt. On occasion I’ve assisted in the smuggling of women and children out of the country to escape hopeless situations. I had a 25 year marriage to an Egyptian man that was good, but I’ve seen plenty of horror stories and almost without exception they were embarked upon with the same amount of thought and planning that someone would expend on a shopping trip to their local mall. As you mention yourself, you were a naive 22 year old who had never traveled abroad before. Would you have read and believed this warning? I wouldn’t be surprised to imagine that plenty of naive young women will read that warning and say “But not my Ahmed…” I’ve had it said to my face early in a friendship and then there are embarrassed admissions later. I’ve seen similar situations in 40 and 50 year old women who should certainly have their wits about them, but who seem to have checked them at the airport to be misdirected to some other destination. And not all of these are picked up by young hotties who use their attractiveness to lure older women. I have to admit to being quite baffled by many of the choices.

    I spend a lot of time telling women that they MUST not assume that the values that they were raised with are those that they will find in a cross cultural marriage. Your experience sounds like a perfect example of what I warn against. Many of the very worst experiences that I’ve seen have come from an alliance contracted in a country other than Egypt. A nice female college student falls for a male Egyptian college student who is studying abroad and when she comes back here with her new husband, she discovers that her husband might have been raised on the moon for all that they have in common. How do you warn against this? This isn’t a simple problem and it isn’t just a situation of white slavery or something. It is a major misunderstanding of cultures and the roles of husbands and wives and a serious lack of information on one’s legal rights and obligations. These rights and obligations may be understood in Canada (and I’m willing to bet that you’d find an astonishing lack of comprehension among citizens there) but they are not translatable to Egypt. And to be honest, getting advice from local Egyptians isn’t very reliable. I always suggest finding a good lawyer before doing anything. Marriage in Egypt is a legal transaction not a love match on the whole, even though love does enter into it.

    I’m glad to see that you’ve made it through to the other side and I daresay that you aren’t anywhere near as naive anymore. I’m not against a warning on the embassy website but rather than just saying “Watch out” it should say something to the effect that the laws regarding marriage in Egypt are totally different from the laws regarding marriage in Canada and anyone considering marriage to an Egyptian would be well-advised to look into the legal ramifications in detail. Assuming that the marriage ends up as one of the good ones, the warning doesn’t even begin to go into the rather byzantine inheritance and child custody laws that go into effect should an Egyptian husband of a foreign wife die. And frankly, most Egyptians don’t even know how they work. I’m not against the warning…I don’t think that it’s well-phrased or useful enough.

  • Mamdouh El Dakhakhny

    Now ,I have been following your comments and trying to construct your story and find out more about your background.Being a male feminist myself ,I believe very much in the race ,class,gender paradigm.So does your story go as follows.Where you abducted by somebody and was your mobile stolen or taken or what?And then did you marry the person who stole your money and took him with you to Canada?Your story somehow does not hold water or maybe there is something I am missing.I am against any form of sexual abuse be it male or female and be it Canadian or Egyptian.But ,I can’t really make head or tail of what you are saying and don’t tell me it is because the langauge barrier if you please

  • Ms Ozzie

    Thank you one and all for this debate and content. It answers for me questions I had as to why a young Egyptian male from the Khan El Khalili markets picked me out for special attention. While I am safely ensconced back in my own country on the other side of the world, communication by email and text messages can still make the most amazing connection and invoke emotions and feelings I’d not thought possible. As someone said in an earlier blog, it’s easy to think \No not my Ahmed..\ but then again, why not.
    I did not go to Egypt looking for a man. I travelled with friends on a holiday to somewhere we had never been before. Obviously it is easy to spot someone who is unattached (rings or lack thereof on fingers, who you are with or not with) and therefore a potential target. Exchange an email addresses, take a photo…all very normal and nice tourist type stuff. No one really expects anything to come from it. But take it a little further – a young, attractive, presumably poor, Egyptian male sets up contact via Facebook (I did create a separate and isolated page from my normal site) phones me one night on my mobile – that is not cheap to do. After the shock and also delight, the messages start to get more fervent and personal. It’s flattering and nice – who wouldn’t feel good getting them from a young, attractive and dark exotic \friend\. No emotional baggage, no relationship history, no demands, and not a random stranger on an internet site (this is someone I actually did meet)…yes very alluring.

    I’m 50kgs, 165 cm, athletic, fit, attractive and an all together nice person. I went through Egypt smiling and treating people with respect, an easy smile and with a fun attitude. I met some lovely people and had no inappropriate or offensive behaviour from Egyptian men. I did travel with some American girls who did have a few unpleasant encounters at the Egyptian Museum so know it happens.

    I found this particular young Egyptian sorrowful, sad, gentle, courteous and honest (he refused the offer of money when someone broke something in his shop and chased us to return a camera left in his store). I saw his life as he may see it – little to look forward to but day after day, month after month, year after year working to scrape a living from tourists. He made his feelings very clear to me before I left the markets that day, despite me telling him I had teenaged children.

    I can’t be rude to people, it’s not the way I was brought up. My natural caring nature and empathy meant I treated him with respect and did not want to hurt his feelings. I had seen enough fellow tourists being rude to Egyptians who were simply trying to eke out a meagre living.

    Fortunately I am a natural skeptic and know from others in multi-cultural relationships how challenging they can be – so not assuming for myself for a moment there would ever be anything other than a friendship that would simply go nowhere once we left. As someone who counts my blessings and been able to travel extensively, I feel for those who are born into less. I work hard for what I have but have had one or two lucky breaks, being in the right place at the right time, and am grateful for my life.

    I recognise that vulnerability opens up this type of misguided interaction very easily. Love, companionship, affection, intimacy are what humans crave ordinarily. Remove them and see how different your world can be. Any wonder men and women alike can find \victims\ so easily. Sad but true.

    I sit here now writing this because I have a text message I am yet to answer from him. He has not asked for money, or help to get him out of Egypt. At 25-28 years of age (I’m not sure how old he actually is and it’s not relevant anyway), it’s doubtful he has the means and wherewithall to leave his country. He has offered to marry me (I’ve never divorced for that very reason and never intend to remarry anyway) and rent us a flat in Cairo. It will never happen. But it is lovely when someone says these things to you. Even though I have male friends in my own country I have special relationships with, I can still take the flattery and attention easily.

    I am encouraging my Egyptian young man to find a wife in Egypt because I want him to be happy. What I had initially intended was to build his self-esteem by pointing out the good qualities I saw in him but feel this has probably only fuelled the interactions.

    I think this type of sharing of info has the best intentions. We can generalise at best about any country or culture but the warnings should be there for discerning people to read and decide for themselves. I do not think all Egyptian men are tied to the same brush. I do not see these comments as racial, merely informational and generalised and based on individual experiences. Circumstances, culture and conditions shape us all – information is important to understand differences and I thank everyone for their comments. Now if anyone has advice as to what I put in my next text message….feel free to suggest.

    • How about just saying what you said here…you were married once before and are still legally married because you have no intention of doing so another time. You have grown children and feel strongly that he should pursue a more attainable goal. Truth is usually a good thing.

  • Kristina Bergmann

    These comments are very strange. About what are we talking exactly: sex tourists looking for an egyptian man or women tired of being followed by egyptians? These are two things. A third problem ist, if you are a half egyptian, you will be considered by egyptian authorities as Egyptians and in that case the consulate of the other nationality can’t do a lot. Maybe it is their mistake, but anyhow that is the situation… So the important thing is: that egyptian men are following women – egyptian and foreign. That is a fact which every woman in Egypt will admit. There are also studies to prove it. I live in Egypt and I think a reasonnable woman should not accept that. And if she likes a guy and wants sex that is not a reason to accept all men to follow her – or is it?? For egyptian men that woman will be a “prostitute” anyway – but does that mean she should accept to be called like this and to be followed? No, because women fought many many years in the West to change these distorted ideas, so why she should put herself down again? There is a film called: “Ni soumises ni prostituées”. It says all about today’s emancipation… the world should accept, that women changed,, also in Egypt that must be accepted. Women are human beings, whereever.
    Kristina

  • I met him on line spoke to him for 8 months, he is yella emshee husband. lol I am pooor if he wants greencard good luck usa makes it very bad for arabs to get green card. But great personal relationship when he is here and I am a cougar and poor. Who wins?
    I do lolol he satisfies my thrist of love so show me what you got? lol

  • Mell

    I have read all he comments..and it is true to be aware of Egyptian men. My husband is from Egypt and I can say he put on a really good show at first.
    But the Green Card came and changed everything! All of a sudden he is too tired to work anymore, he just sits at home all day and eats, sleep, and talks on the phone with his friends. Since I dont speak Arabic, I have no clue what the conversation is about. Thank God with the help of some friend I am in the process of getting out…and it is true. they use everything to keep you in the marriage just for the sake of what they can get out of it. All he talks about is getting his citizenship, and making money. But he does not want to work…so yes be aware of Egyptian men….

  • charlie

    i have fell in love with a wonderful man from cairo egypt,we have never meet face to face,but have been talking on line with our webcam talking every single day for now 10 months,we talk about getting married soon,i will be joining him in 1 month,he has’nt ask for money,but i offered to help him from time to time and he didnt want to except it,but did,I love him he is the most amazing man i have ever meet,tell me what you think,i have meet all his family and kids,they also are wonderful,,,

    • Love and support are wonderful. Marriage is an act of law…two totally different realms. Be absolutely sure to understand the legal ramifications of marriage in Egypt…what are your rights and obligations under the law. If you go into something like this with a clear understanding, your chances of success are much, much better.

    • Be carefull! I met my husband on line and globalization is everywhere so my husband does have a wife in Egypt , children you really do not know this man untill you live with him. Before he arrived in my home everything personal and sensitive I removed from my home. I did not change my name to his….check this man out first through your goverment..not his.

  • Derek Everage

    I am a man who traveled all over the world, and i could hardley wait ,to grow tall enough, and old enough ,to reach the tickett counter ,so that i could buy a plane tickett , and go experience other countries ,and other cultures, now there is one thing that i discovered ,that holds true to every race, cultural, and gender, that is ,there are Saints , and there are Devils ,everywhere, so we all must be prayed up enough, and wise enough to be able to tell the difference between the two.

  • I have been married to an egyptian man since september 21,2008 and I have spent only six weeks with him. lol I have not seen my husband now for 6 months as of july 20,2009. I seem to feel there is a controversy here with the real men marrying women out of Egypt. I am not from the land of milk and honey and certainly now at this point will be his Mrs. smith if he so likes …me to be this way ,but, immigration has made it very difficult for my new husband to stay here. Also, before he went back to Egypt I called the number in Egypt and his wife there said he would be home shortly, lol so now the rules change, learn arabic ladies and the saga continues !

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