China:Korean professor under catcalls
On 31st, October, several Chinese portal websites released the news: the Korean professor Zheng Zaishu in Ehwa University suggested that, contrasted with the common sense, the Chinese mythology mainly originated from Korea. His theory was based on the fact that many gods mentioned in Chinese mythology Legends of Mountains and Seas could be found in Goguryeo frescos.
Below the text, the websites furthermore attached a list that numerated the controversies on culture between China and Korea from 2005 to now, including those on Dragon Boat Festival, the origin of printing (one of the 4 great inventions of China) and traditional Chinese medicine.
Soon, Chinese blogsphere began to protest against his theory. in 163.com, for example, more than 3000 replies put Professor Zheng Zaishu under critiques. More than half of the replies despised Korea as a country of self-contempt that tried to seek comfort in self-deception and steal culture from its neighbor China. Many netizens stroke back the professor’s idea by claiming that Koreans are actually descents of Chinese. The most widely cited comment, a metaphor concerning plastic surgery, straightforwardly disdains Korea. Because most of the catcalls had impolite remarks, a netizen from Korea (the location is shown on the website) urged Chinese netizens not to abuse, but was soon inundated under the 100 pages of discussions. In a survey by 163.com, 1960 people vote the option that Korea is a “small country with provincial people”, while 1244 people think “we Chinese had better rescue our culture rather than to dispute with others”.
(No netizens’ comments directly quoted to avoid further controversy)
65 comments
And I also think you miss a point here.
It is Koreans who brought out all these issues, such as HanZi originating from Korea, Confucius was actually Korean. I don’t have encough background in Korean and Chinese history, so I am not gonna say whether these claims are right or wrong.
Based on your comments, it seems like you don’t believe they were right, because you said I would get this WTF face if I ever ask such a question. Now IF they were wrong, what do you think would happen to the younger generations growing up in such an environment? Chinese reaction is actually quite understandable. Just imagine the Chinese starting to teach their kids that the entire Europe belongs to China, what is gonna happen?
Does this sound like Koreans are stealing Chinese writing system to you? Get a grip.
http://english.chosun.com/w21data/html/news/200801/200801090022.html
Culture/Sports
Updated Jan.9,2008 09:41 KST
World’s Biggest Chinese Character Dictionary Nearly Complete
Former Diplomat Publishes “Chinese Characters in Korean”
20% of Freshmen Can’t Write Names in Chinese
Ignorance of Chinese is Ignorance of Korean
Korea will soon see completion of the world’s largest Chinese character dictionary. Dankook University Institute of Oriental Studies on Tuesday announced its “Dictionary of Chinese Characters Korean Use”, the fruit of 30 years’ labor, will be finished in April and the full set will be published in May.
Not that I care at all, but for the sake of argument, who invented this system? How can you be sure it was a “Chinese”? A concept of “Chinese” is made up of multitude of Asian ethnicities. So which ethnicity within this larger Chinese group invented the writing? And how can the Chinese people be so sure?
“Confucius was actually Korean”
Can I ask you which “Korean” actually said that?
Are you sure it wasn’t another fake Korean professor that was made up by the Chinese media? (which also have a recent history of making up a fake Korean professor named Park Chung Soo from Seoul National University that never existed)
The Chinese government is starting an anti-Korea wave.
That’s why the Chinese media just named the Korean drama “Dae Jang Ching” (Chinese translated name) as the most hated drama in China. It’s also the reason why the question of “which country is the most hated country in China” was rigged. And you say Koreans are the ones insecure – geez.
“Chinese reaction is actually quite understandable. Just imagine the Chinese starting to teach their kids that the entire Europe belongs to China, what is gonna happen?”
Once again, I reiterate. Where are you getting this that Koreans are teaching their kids that Hanzi is Korean? Where is the evidence that this is the Korean school curriculum? You cannot give any evidence simply because it’s not true and it doesn’t exist. And you can’t point to this lone professor as proof. Just because some Korean acadamia says doesn’t mean it’s backed up by Korean government nor his views held by majority of Koreans. Unlike in the PRC, in Korea, the academia and government are separate, where anyone can express their opinion or publish works.
Uhh, “World’s Biggest Chinese Character Dictionary Nearly Complete” What are you trying to say by mentioning that? Oh, wait, “how can the Chinese people be so sure (they invented Chinese”?
Now I get it, you meant to say it is possible that Koreans invented Chinese characters. If I remembered correctly, there was a period of time the Korean government forced its people to stop using Chinese characters altother. It is interesting to see a government trying to eradicate Chinese orthography while some claimed that it was Koreans who invented this type of writing.
Also for the sake of argument, Chinese identity was indeed nonexistent back in history, and the same is true for Korean identity, American identity, etc. Since Chinese characters are often refered to as HanZi, I assume it was the Han people who invented. But again, I have no credible expertise in hisory, so I am not gonna elaborate. But I think it is widely accepted that the Han people has the longest history of using it.
Regarding the argument of fake korean professor. Why would the Chinese media create a fake figure that could be easily found out to be nonexistent? As for as I know,the Chinese government is the world’s most recreant and stupid government which tried its best not to provoke enmity, sometimes at the expense of itself.
Have you ever watched “Dae Jang Ching”? If you did, then you would know why it is considered the most hated drama in China.
Regarding you last post:
“Just because some Korean acadamia says …” No matter it is backed up by Korean government or not, the fact that “some Korean acadamia…” is enough to incite discontentment. Often those acadamia’s claims would draw many advocates who would consider them heros for “digging out” the glory of ancient korean history. (Oops, I shouldn’t use the term korean here, it didn’t exist at that time.)
“Unlike in the PRC, in Korea, the academia and government are separate, where anyone can express their opinion or publish works.”
I could also ask you whether you have been involved in academia in China? If not, I could just ignore your argument here.
And I do NOT believe the academia and government in Korea are really separate. But that’s what I think, I have not been to Korea, so I would not say anything like that when arguing with anyone.
Many people use the fact that Chinese government is a communist (It really is ????) to support their argument that everything in China is controlled by the state, and that everything the Chinese people, media and the government itself say is always planned and fake. Honestly, whenever I see this kind of argument, I lost the patience and desire to talk. I believe the only reason they use this lame argument is because they don’t have anything else to support their arguments. Ideology is a barrier people could never overcome. How could a biased mind give something that is impartial?
One more thought on “How can the Chinese people so sure (they invented HanZi?)” Honestly, I don’t think you can be sure of many things. Only evidence counts.
why the hell do you think they call it HanZi if it weren’t invented by Han Chinese?
and why are some Chinese angry at changing the name Hancheng into Seoul? Because Seoul is the Korean way of saying it, the Chinese who are angry are simply thinking “why the hell should we pronounce it the Korean way?”
and now I’m asking JJ, why would the Chinese government start an anti-Korean wave? The rivaling superpowers are the US and China, S.Korea is simply a US military base. Saying the Chinese government trying to start an anti-Korean wave is like saying the USSR trying to beat the US in the Cold War by being anti-French.
JJ
Why do you have to bring up things that are not related to this argument? Whenever there’s a hard arguement, just bring up the CHinese government. THey are behind everything. That’s like 50% of your argument. pretty awesome.
I was reading on a Japanese website and it was all in Japanese, even the story about the Korean theory that Sima Qian is Korean and hence the “Records of the Grand Historian” written by Sima Qian belongs to Korea. This is the korean media that reported this theory. http://www.daejonilbo.com/
Too bad I couldnt find the original japanese website. but anyway here’s a copy, u will be amaze how the japanese respond. Written in Japanese with Chinese translation. As you can see, the author put 【韩国】大田日报, A korean media.
3月15日【韩国】大田日报——司马迁が史记で歴史歪曲国祖檀君奉安金会长
……（前略）蚩尤天王に対しても中国の歴史歪曲を指摘した。「蚩尤天王は古朝鲜前の桓雄国(18代1565年)の第14代慈乌智桓雄を言う。蚩尤天王は中国人たちが自分たちの始祖と称える轩辕黄帝と琢鹿(たくろく)の野(や)で胜って、彼らに文明を伝えました。」ところが、中国は司马迁の史记で「擒杀蚩尤」すなわち「蚩尤を捕まえて杀した」と书いて歪曲を始め、现在の小学校からこのような教育をさせる、というのだ。私たちの歴史教育とは対照的ということだ。金会长は教育人的资源部で発行した中学校（韩国）国史教科书には甚だしくは古朝鲜建国年代(BC2333年)さえ表记しないで、ただ‘古かった’といった程度の表记をする我々の歴史教育の现実を批判した。
民族的な自负心なしに世界の舞台に出るとことは危険な発想です。民族魂は无限の竞争に打ち胜つことができる大きな资だからです。」
翻译：国祖檀君奉安金会长（72岁）指出：中国历史肆意歪曲蚩尤天王
“蚩尤天王说的是古朝鲜前的桓雄国(18代1565年)的第14代慈乌智桓雄，蚩尤天王在琢鹿战胜了中国称之为始祖的轩辕黄帝后，向他们传播了文明 ”但是中国的司马迁的史记却开始歪曲历史说什么“擒杀蚩尤”，现在的小学也在接受这样的教育。应该对照我们的历史教育。金会长对教育人的资源部发行的中学历史教科书不正确标注古朝鲜建国年代（公元前2333年），而是简单的称之为古代的时候这种历史教育现实进行了批判。
没有民族自豪感登上世界的舞台是非常危险的，民族的灵魂才是能战胜所有挑战的根本！
日本网民的回帖：
2008/03/17(月)21:04:50IDzWIVpu2
ついに司马迁まで来たか。
译：终于轮到司马迁了。
2008/03/17(月)21:04:53ID:uU+3m6po
アホな！
译：神经病！
2008/03/17(月)21:05:28ID:f42XXgcM
电波すぎるｗｗｗｗｗｗｗｗｗ
译：太雷了！
2008/03/17(月)21:06:42ID:wChlp7Zy
ちょｗｗｗ史记が捏造ですかwwwwwwww
译：又开始捏造历史了不是？
2008/03/17(月)21:06:42ID:79RNskbs
やっぱ、やつらにとっては歴史って「こうあってほしい」と愿うものなのか
译：果然啊，这群家伙是不是觉得“我希望是这样的”就是历史啊？
2008/03/17(月)21:06:54ID:5rLieQS8
司马迁にまで难癖つけるの？！いったい司马迁が韩国の歴史を捏造して何の得があるというのだ？
译：司马迁也敢质疑啊？！到底司马迁捏造韩国历史能得到什么啊？
2008/03/17(月)21:07:03ID:vMLyOQoZ
でもきっと伟大な司马迁は韩民族の血を引いているんでしょうねｗｗ
译：一定是伟大的司马迁也具有韩国血缘，啊哈哈~
2008/03/17(月)21:07:27ID:9BwFE7xd
久々の强烈电波だなｗｗｗ
译：很久没被这么雷过了….！
2008/03/17(月)21:07:36ID:vMLyOQoZ
ＹＥＳ！ＹＥＳ！ＹＥＳ！ＯＨＭＹＧＯＤ！！
2008/03/17(月)21:07:43ID:gTY9mVW0
头になんか刺さってるけどｗｗｗｗｗｗｗｗｗｗ顽张れｗｗｗｗｗｗｗｗｗ
译：头好像被什么给穿刺了。。。。。加油干啊！
2008/03/17(月)21:07:50ID:zTFkPZib
自分たちが兴味の対象になってたって信じているのが哀れ。
译：相信自己会是别人感兴趣的对象，这点韩国人真够可悲的。
2008/03/17(月)21:10:39ID:5Vz9AMHI
いよいよ小说の中の空想が歴史的事実にされるんだな。
译：又开始把小说的空想当历史了。
2008/03/17(月)21:10:39IDzWIVpu2
そもそも蚩尤のいた场所って半岛なのか？
译：原来蚩尤是在朝鲜半岛啊，哈哈哈~
2008/03/17(月)21:11:00ID:1xkw4z3V
韩国人はもしかしたら、自分たちが偏ってると思わんのか。
译：韩国人真的不觉得自己很滑稽吗？
2008/03/17(月)21:11:04ID:Z8uoukzu
歴史の建て直しって捏造の事だろ。
译：在韩国人看来历史是可以重建的。
2008/03/17(月)21:11:26ID:dW89LusF
司马迁の史记もかい…强烈な电波だな…歴史に関しては宗主国も书物がなくて日本に頼ってる有様なのにな。
译：明明关于自己的历史，宗主国不给写还得指靠日本的，居然连司马迁的史记也…强烈的被雷…
2008/03/17(月)21:11:36ID:65W6mZln
そもそも蚩尤はミャオ族らしいんだが半岛関系ねーｗｗｗｗ
译：蚩尤不是苗族的吗？跟半岛有什么关系！
2008/03/17(月)21:11:49ID:fe2UMWzN
中国でも日本でも歴史书の通りの発掘がなされることがある。だから歴史书の真伪が确かめられることとなる。韩国には歴史书がないのでやりたい 放题。
译：无论中国还是日本都有根据史书记载的发掘，所以能辨别史书的真伪。韩国没历史书所以可以尽情编造。
2008/03/17(月)21:12:18ID:yYa8Y4kq
これは…いくら韩国人がバカでも、これは间违ってるって言う奴が居るだろ。
译：这…韩国人再愚蠢，也应该有人知道这种说法太荒唐了吧。
2008/03/17(月)21:16:30ID:kW4IkixS
歴史に関しては中国に味方する。
译：关于历史我站在中国这边。
2008/03/17(月)21:20:21ID:S+/kCyzx
私は韩国人です.中国が韩国の5千年歴史を否定することに堪えることができません.日本人たちに助けを要请します.日本人たちなら韩国を支持する と思います。
译：我是韩国人，无法忍受中国否定韩国五千年的历史，邀请日本人民的帮助，我想日本人民会支持我们韩国的。
2008/03/17(月)21:20:54ID:Amh/ypcl
だが断る。捏造は武士には似合わない。
译：拒绝，捏造不适合武士。
2008/03/17(月)21:22:18IDfjbKz/z
よし、まずは『古事记』と『日本书纪』を読む所から始めてみようか。
译：可以，先从认真学习《古事记》和《日本书纪》开始吧。
2008/03/17(月)21:24:37ID:CIbr9gsp
アホとお付き合いする気は有りません。
译：没兴趣和神经病打交道。
2008/03/17(月)21:18:38ID:A1DnVfB6
史记より信凭性の高い文献や考古学的な证拠があるのか？ソースが脳内だったら笑うぞ。っていうかもう笑っていいかな？
译：能拿出来比史记更高的可信文献或者考古的证据吗？要说只是在脑子里的想象我可就要笑了。嗯..请问我是不是可以开始笑了啊？
2008/03/17(月)21:19:02ID:/UDPUZgw
史记が歪曲か???いったい何と比べたんだろう？それよりも古くて确证のある史料なんかあったっけ？
译：歪曲历史？到底拿什么来做比较啊？还是先说说朝鲜有比《史记》更古老准确的证据吗？
2008/03/17(月)21:26:31ID8ArggxY
朝鲜人は今すぐ司马迁に土下座して谢れ。と言っても本人はもう居ないから男は全员去势して、女は30歳以下は全员整形した上で売春宿送りにしろ あ、女はすでにかなりの确率で実行してるか。
译：朝鲜人现在马上跪求司马迁原谅。即使这样说本人已经不在了。那么就男的全部阉了，女的30岁以下全员整形后送妓院。啊，忘了，韩国女的基本上都已经整过形了。
2008/03/17(月)21:28:01ID:UmWHtzSJ
きっと朝鲜人は、「司马迁は苗字が二文字だから日本人ニダ」、とか言い出すよ。
译：朝鲜人一定会说“司马迁的姓是复姓，所以是日本人思密达”。
2008/03/17(月)21:29:44ID:uTPFobsF
これ谁か百度にはってこいよ。东方最大の歴史家を诈欺师扱いとは、これ以上の侮辱はない。いますぐ半岛が弾圧されて朝鲜人が绝灭しようと、何 の文句ももはや言えなくなった。
译：谁把这给贴百度去啊。把东方最大的历史学家说成是诈骗犯，没有比着更侮辱人的了。现在就是马上把半岛的朝鲜人全给灭绝了谁也不会觉得过分。
I don’t know if this will convince you.
http://news.naver.com/main/read.nhn?mode=LSD&mid=sec&sid1=102&oid=089&aid=0000138984
Dont give me oh it’s the chinese government behind all these craps.
I am LOL. Look at the length of civilization and start from there. China has 5000+ years, how old is South Korea? jm what was Korea’s previous writing language? Chinese!
Stop trying to steal our glorious history and civilization, because you will NEVER succeed.